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Post by harrisracing on Jan 13, 2010 11:57:57 GMT -6
HAHA I know - it will be soon I'm aiming to win that bet that you took with Andy. You know, the one where you said you'd run (5) 1:19.x laps in a row. I just did 1:20's this race...charity challenge the car will be even faster (and uglier with more used/junkyard parts on it). Has anyone been faster on this combined tire patch yet? Not to mention Hankooks are crap, but has it happened before? I'm very curious. Also has anyone been faster on a smaller motor? I'm 2.0L with a stock hair-dryer. Talking production cars here - leave the tube-cars ouf of it. Patrick
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lane
I just want to go fast!
Posts: 164
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Post by lane on Jan 13, 2010 15:07:35 GMT -6
Ok Patrick, I see why you don't want to hear anything about spec tires seeing as to where you bought a dozen tires in a close out! Besides I'm talking about the original "Bracket classes" not the "GT classes". The Red bracket is a very competitive class always has been but the idea of bracket class racing was to have a low budget race group to run in without having to break the bank to be competitive. This is in a discussion phase right now and if the powers to be decide that this is not good for the series then so be it. Or if at all possible they could have a tire contingency program but then that could lead into something else.
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Post by Fast Guys on Jan 13, 2010 15:14:08 GMT -6
Lane, I'd be happy to have any hp at my rear wheels. Maybe with Carver's mad fabrication skills and that spare engine we could make that happen. LOL, if Lane's makin' a buck twenty nine at the rear wheel, I'm probably somewhere in the 95-105 bhp range... T No, Lane can drive.
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troym
I just want to go fast!
Posts: 145
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Post by troym on Jan 13, 2010 15:27:14 GMT -6
It's nice to see things returning to normal around here with Andy busting T's chops. There's been way to much harmony between you 2 over the past few weeks.
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Post by harrisracing on Jan 13, 2010 15:32:55 GMT -6
Ok Patrick, I see why you don't want to hear anything about spec tires seeing as to where you bought a dozen tires in a close out! Besides I'm talking about the original "Bracket classes" not the "GT classes". The Red bracket is a very competitive class always has been but the idea of bracket class racing was to have a low budget race group to run in without having to break the bank to be competitive. This is in a discussion phase right now and if the powers to be decide that this is not good for the series then so be it. Or if at all possible they could have a tire contingency program but then that could lead into something else. Lane, That's fine, you put your opinion out here for the race committee to see, but I also have the right to put mine out here. In my opinion, "spec" tires for a bracket class are a bad reason because: 1) The slower car in the bracket on the "spec" tire could be more competitive with a "faster" tire at only a marginal increase in cost (compare R888 and V710 in the same size for example). 2) How are you going to limit grip by a tire brand alone? What's next, size? 3) IF we then limit the brand and the size, then You still need Moton's etc. to beat the next guy on the same tires - so your point is moot. This is why spec miata requires all the same suspension / etc. 4) Then maybe limit what kind of shocks you can run? so on and so forth - so where do we draw the line? I'm sorry, but this "open design" or "run what you brung" is the basis of our local racing philosophy and is why it is so successful. Remember, you are racing for an $8 trophy. If it's worth the price of Moton's etc for that, then that decision is up to you and we're not keeping you from spending $5k and new tires every week to get it. As Clint stated, find out where your car falls, set a budget on what quality tires you can afford, and then tune the car to fit the class. Trust me, mine was in no-man's land as well in the GT classes and I'm very proud (and pretty lucky) to have gone so well on crappy tires, free wheels, and $800 used coilovers. Again I don't mean to offend, I'm just trying to use logic that might help you and/or other people in your situation. Patrick
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Post by harrisracing on Jan 13, 2010 15:42:13 GMT -6
Ok Patrick, I see why you don't want to hear anything about spec tires seeing as to where you bought a dozen tires in a close out! Besides I'm talking about the original "Bracket classes" not the "GT classes". The Red bracket is a very competitive class always has been but the idea of bracket class racing was to have a low budget race group to run in without having to break the bank to be competitive. This is in a discussion phase right now and if the powers to be decide that this is not good for the series then so be it. Or if at all possible they could have a tire contingency program but then that could lead into something else. And furthermore. I race what's cheap and I drive around all those problems. Since I haven't found anything on closeout I have now ordered 18" wheels for my car so I can start running take-off slicks for $50-90 each. I will have to cut the fenders and make some custom ones, but it will allow me to get to the track more and do some RACING! Also, remember, I was beat this weekend after driving my best average lap time EVER, by a guy who broke his car in qualifying only to put it in his trailer and pull out HIS OTHER GT2 CAR! So before you go off thinking that I don't know how it feels to be robbed of first place, or thrown into a tough class, think about that I must say though that I would be MUCH more frustrated with someone sandbagging heavily in my class...but again if they want to ride around at 70% for a trophy...let them have it because they are not having as much fun as I am TRYING MY HARDEST to catch them! Patrick
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lane
I just want to go fast!
Posts: 164
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Post by lane on Jan 13, 2010 17:27:45 GMT -6
Remember this all came about because there is talk of bumping a car to the next class if said car breaks out twice in one year. Which is very doable for me and a number of other people in red bracket if weather conditions are right. There are some cars that are going to break out on a regular basis if the driver really tries to drive the car. So rather than lose cars to a higher class I would rather see an affordable spec tire be put in place such as Toyo that will possibly keep the times up and costs down. I'm a big fan of low cost racing and I guarantee you there are more out there that would agree with this philosphy. I'm sure someone else will chime in here on this so please do. Also I would like to state that I have been racing this series since 2003. The series has changed its name a few times and rules have changed but there are a few of us that have hung with it. I imagine that we will see a bunch of ya'll come and go to do something bigger and better. So have fun!
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Post by melan45 on Jan 13, 2010 20:12:58 GMT -6
i have three kids under 5...if i am not at this track, i am not going any where but to the house and that only 30mins away. you can count on me lane. i am wondering if i should have one more so maybe the government can subsidize my red bracket fever.
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Post by turbot on Jan 14, 2010 7:30:27 GMT -6
HAHA I know - it will be soon I'm aiming to win that bet that you took with Andy. You know, the one where you said you'd run (5) 1:19.x laps in a row. I just did 1:20's this race...charity challenge the car will be even faster (and uglier with more used/junkyard parts on it). Has anyone been faster on this combined tire patch yet? Not to mention Hankooks are crap, but has it happened before? I'm very curious. Patrick Oh I dunno but that plays to your advantage.....to run a one off car; with home made parts; on tires that nobody else can give any feedback on; then talk all your equipment down. By formula, your car should be racing against 3.4 (minimum) normally aspirated engined cars at 2200 lbs (don't remember your weight). Conveniently enough.....there aint no direct competitors. We race 225/245/16 tires....some of us treaded. 2650 w driver and 2750 w driver with the turbo calipers. 120 hp at the rear wheel. Come on in and join in anytime you think you can run a 1.24. T
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Post by turbot on Jan 14, 2010 7:34:49 GMT -6
LOL, if Lane's makin' a buck twenty nine at the rear wheel, I'm probably somewhere in the 95-105 bhp range... T No, Lane can drive. You're more than welcomed to come play with us too Andy. PCA doesn't discriminate. I can forward you the SP2 rules in PDF and I have a complete body that I will give to you or Patrick. Maybe if you two team up on it... T
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Post by turbot on Jan 14, 2010 7:41:32 GMT -6
It's nice to see things returning to normal around here with Andy busting T's chops. There's been way to much harmony between you 2 over the past few weeks. Andy's day of reckoning is drawing near and he's getting a bit nervous is all. Sooner or later, he'll have to run the #3 car and see if he measures up to 3-time lapping day DE'er turned racer, Paul Burch's shoes. As for me....., I'm fine. The car I'm driving hadn't been faster than a 1.27 in the last year the previous driver ran it. I'm close to 2 seconds quicker than that in the same car and haven't even opened the hood except for oil changes.... ;D T
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Post by turbot on Jan 14, 2010 7:42:17 GMT -6
LOL, if Lane's makin' a buck twenty nine at the rear wheel, I'm probably somewhere in the 95-105 bhp range... T No, Lane can drive. I hear Wedge is pretty darned quick too..... T
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Post by melan45 on Jan 14, 2010 8:21:16 GMT -6
times...shmimez. who can brag about their times when mitch's breaking miata track records 1:23.00. now that is something to brag about. carver broke the 1:23 barrier...all causes for a round of applause. a large portion of our personal best can be attributed to weather conditions.
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Post by harrisracing on Jan 14, 2010 8:23:16 GMT -6
Again it starts to sound more and more like you guys are trying to make pca rule cars fit nicely into Winning a bracket class - that's not what we offer. It's really THIS SIMPLE: if you can't hit the target time for the class save your money and detune the car or add weight to drop class. I also argued that our rules and penalties for breakout are fine the way they are now. No reason to force a bump.
I think you guys ought to start catering your cars to meet the rules as opposed to vice versa.
Furthermore, T,your comments about who my car should be competing against are showing your nievity. It has held off 6.0l cars, tube chasis panoz, 3.6l porsches (which by all rights could weigh less than my car), a slew of m3's, minis etc. So, are you Still knocking my driving skill? If so I would be very glad to take any co-driver challenge any day you'd like.
Patrick
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Post by melan45 on Jan 14, 2010 8:43:48 GMT -6
Again it starts to sound more and more like you guys are trying to make pca rule cars fit nicely into Winning a bracket class - that's not what we offer. It's really THIS SIMPLE: if you can't hit the target time for the class save your money and detune the car or add weight to drop class. I also argued that our rules and penalties for breakout are fine the way they are now. No reason to force a bump. I think you guys ought to start catering your cars to meet the rules as opposed to vice versa. Furthermore, T,your comments about who my car should be competing against are showing your nievity. It has held off 6.0l cars, tube chasis panoz, 3.6l porsches (which by all rights could weigh less than my car), a slew of m3's, minis etc. So, are you Still knocking my driving skill? If so I would be very glad to take any co-driver challenge any day you'd like. Patrick yea dude on top of that you were leading some high-dollar stuff(40k+ invest) around the track too and you rod has been trouble free for this entire season. my hats off to you man.
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